The Non-Tech Founders' Podcast

Laura: Hello, and welcome to the Non-Tech Founders podcast, fortnightly conversations about running a business as a non-technical founder. I'm Laura. And I'm Nathan. Join us as we navigate the developer dominated world of entrepreneurship, bootstrapping and beyond. So this is our first episode.

Nathan: Dun, Dun, dun . Our first, our first rerecorded.

Yeah,

Laura: we might have done one of these before that didn't turn out so well. So we are redoing it, but that's fine. . So it is gonna be a short one because we are just basically going to tell you a little bit about what this podcast is gonna be about. Uh, we're going to introduce ourselves and we are both founders and we are not developers.

We've met. Years ago. How many? Five years ago? No,

Nathan: long, longer. It was two. 2014. 2014.

Laura: 2014. Yeah. That's eight. Eight years . Yeah. And Nathan's probably one of the only non-tech founders I know. So we've obviously kept in touch because there are specific challenges that we face as non-technical people in this world.

So we thought, hey, There's no other podcast dealing with this kind of stuff, so why don't we, uh, why don't we start

Nathan: one? It's, um, it's, it's really difficult to find any, any content for non, for non-technical founders. And while there are shows, obviously that deal in general with entrepreneurship and all that kind of good stuff, there was nothing that sort of focused on, on folks like us.

So we wanted to try and just put our heads together and, and try and share the, the struggles that we go through. Building, building, business, building, building online businesses, and um, and also. Be able to use it as well as a forum to, uh, to catch up and, and to talk about what we are working on a little bit as well, and share and try and get feedback from, uh, from like-minded people.

Laura: I think the way we sort of described it was it's gonna be part mastermind, but in public. So we'll share what we're doing, what's working, what's not working, um, and then. part, talking about the challenges of being a non-technical founder specifically, but also just anything to do with running a SaaS, running a product based businesses, running courses.

Just basically being a. I guess solo printer is one of the buzzword that we could use, but it's not really, We can, we can go with that. Yes. There's, there's a ton of them out there. Um, but it's not really, we were sort of talking about it. It's not, it's not just for other non-technical founders. So my audience, and I'll get into a little bit about what I do in, in a minute.

My audience is predominantly developers and I actually think. A podcast like this would be really useful for both developers and non-developers because we're gonna be talking a lot about what we are good at as well, which is design. We're both designers. I like to think marketing, content, writing, all that extra stuff because we, we physically can't get bogged down in the code in the development of the product cuz we're unable to do it.

So we've got these other strengths, which I think maybe aren't spoken. As much, at least in a lot of podcasts I listen to.

Nathan: Well, it's a very, it's a very technical, technical orientated, or dominated, as you said in the introduction, sort of, you know, uh, environment, isn't it? You know, typically many, many, certainly smaller, um, software companies are started by developers, aren't they, you know, looking to scratch their own itch or whatever.

So it's, it's a very, very developer orientated world. So hopefully we can bring a, a different perspective to that. There is so much crossover as well. Like you said, your, your, your audience is typically developers, as is mine as well to a, to a smaller extent. But we both teach, uh, to developers and so there's definitely a, a way to be able to, I think, help and un help and understand as well what's going on from both sides of the coin.

Yeah.

Laura: So let's just talk a little bit about who we are and what we do and a little bit about our background. So, do you wanna go first, Nathan?

Nathan: Yeah, sure. So I'm, um, I'm a designer by trade, so I've been a designer for the last 15 years, but over the last probably six or seven years I've been focusing more and more on ux, and, and that's, that's where I work now.

I'll only work on ux, anything, anything even remotely visual then. Talked to Laura in 2013. I, I founded my first SaaS, which was, um, uh, proposal, uh, creation SaaS for design agencies. And that went on to, to about 2019, which was nice cuz it really sort of got my, my feet wet into what it is to build a business and to go from being a designer to being a business owner and everything that comes with that, which, Quite an eye opener.

It's not the same thing at all, . So yeah, that was until 2019. And then since then, I, I sold that, moved on, went dark for a couple of years, completely just dropped off the face of the planet. But yeah, so, you know, I sort of back there writing again, writing, uh, a book called What the ux, which is, uh, trying to teach, uh, UX fundamentals to developers.

There's gonna be a course around that as well. And I'm building my new SaaS now, which is a feature flux, which is a SaaS for product teams to help with version control and, and, and get feedback from sort of stakeholders. So that's, that's pretty much my last 15 years in about 45 seconds. Uh, and here now with Laura, you know, trying to, uh, Trying to reach potentially, I was gonna say another audience, but it's still the same audience as it has been really for the last 15 years, at least within the same space anyway.

Which I guess is a good thing,

Laura: you know? Yeah. Cool. So yeah, I'm Laura, and uh, I am also a designer, but more on the visual side. So I started out as a freelance designer many, many years ago, over 10 years ago. And. Got really tired of the whole trading my time for money thing. So I was always really interested in getting into the product world because I wanted to have something that essentially made money as I sleep, which I know, you know, there's a lot of talk on passive income and how it's not really passive and.

That's definitely true, but I knew that was something that I wanted to get into because I, I still felt like even though I was working for myself, I still felt like I was chained to my desk because I was expected to be there for my clients. So I, uh, I decided to launch a design course, so teaching design to developers, because I felt like I had a little bit of a different angle from most design courses I found.

Very pretentious and just. Great. They didn't really teach you how to make something look good. It was all about, it was just a little bit too woo woo for me. So, uh, that really resonated with people. And I started writing about design with the plans to make a design course, which didn't happen for many years.

Because I got sidetracked, uh, into a product world. I had a accidental product, which I like to call it, called client portal, which I'd already built for myself. I was using it with my clients. I didn't even realize that other people would potentially pay money for it. And I went and spoke at a few conferences about freelancing really.

Up my design course for developers, um, audience, and everyone was saying, Hey, I really like that portal that you mentioned. Like, can I buy it? Do you sell it? So anyway, I, uh, Finally got around to selling it. They convinced me and Client Portal just took off it. It was just crazy. People really liked it and it became my full time thing.

So I very quickly stopped doing the freelance work and was just focused on Client portal full time, which also allowed me to then finally get my Design for Developers course launched. So, That's basically what I've been doing for the last five or six years. Um, a mixture of client portal and design academy.

And then I've got a few other bits going on, like, um, just little side projects and stuff that we've been,

Nathan: I love, I love the fact that it was an accidental product. Yeah, that sounds like, that sounds like something

Laura: in itself. I know it's like, it's sort of it. It's sort of, Yeah. It's a book

Nathan: title. It's a book title.

A way to be written, Laura.

Laura: Yeah. Yeah. I'll write my memoirs. That'll be, That'll be what it's called . Yeah. Always find it a little bit of a shame that it was so accidental. Cuz I like to think, you know, you know, I came up with this great idea and I did research and I did customer interviews and all this like stuff that you're meant to do.

And then, then, then I could like tell people, Hey, this is how you. How you have a great product. But I sort of fell into it, which happens quite a lot. But yeah, there we

Nathan: go. So it wasn't, it definitely wasn't one of those cases for you then where you were looking for a product like, I need to have a product.

I need to have a product. Which is what happened to me.

Laura: Yeah. I was just so focused on having a course. I didn't even realize that I could do products. And I think actually a big part was because I'm not a developer, I figured, well, how am I gonna have a product? I don't have anything behind. Any investment behind me, and I don't really have a ton of money to invest, so I'm not even gonna think about products.

It's gotta be courses. It's the only thing I can do. So, um, That's probably

Nathan: a good, Yeah, I didn't think about it too much either before Nuia. , which I probably should have because it kind of, after MVP was launched, that was it. I, I was, I was buggered. So . Yeah. Oh. But, uh, yeah, it's tricky. Tricky. So, um, here we are, the non-Tech founders podcast.

Are we gonna be out once every, once every two weeks? Is

Laura: that right? Yep. We're gonna be, uh, yeah, out every two weeks. That's the plan. Um, and we are basically, yeah, just gonna, like we said, talk. Different things that we're doing, different things that have worked well, not so well. Um, it's gonna be pretty casual, conversational, but the, uh, the thing that we are thinking of doing is once a month or however, Often is doing q and a episodes, and this is just because I love q and a episodes on other podcasts.

Yeah, me too. I'm Oh good. I'm glad I'm not the only one. Cause I, Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just feel like they always ask the questions that you really want to know. Um, so yeah, feel free to ask us any questions about anything product related or about us, or whatever you would like to know, and we'll do that. Um, but yeah, that's pretty much it.

So

Nathan: should we give out, should we give out the, uh, the email for if people do wanna reach. Yep.

Laura: I don't know

Nathan: it. Okay. , it's uh, I don't know it yet. Okay. I'm sure you're gonna get bored of saying this. It's podcast at the non-tech founders.com. So we'll leave that, we'll leave that in the notes anyway, so if you do have any thoughts or any questions or feedback, then shoot us a line.

We'll definitely get back to you.

Laura: Lovely. All right. So we will, Okay. I guess. Okay. Short and sweets. Ill see you in the next. Definitely,

Nathan: and you can expect longer episodes after today as

Laura: well. . Yeah, it's just a little intro, .

Nathan: Okay, Laura. Speak to you very soon. All right, cheers. Cheers guys. Bye-Bye.